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Tuesday, January 17, 2012
January 26… Labaree’s Competing Purposes of Schools
Are there any major purposes of schooling left out by Labaree? What do you make of his conclusion (Is there any hope to push back against the predominant notion of education as a private good?)?
I think another major purpose of schooling is humanization. The democratic equality is great but only benefits the US, social efficiency benefits the private sector before any other groups, and social mobility benefits only the individual. Humanization would instead benefit society on a global scale. Rather than looking at education simply as a closed system encapsulating the United States, we have to realize that our educational systems affect the entire globe; therefore, another purpose of schooling should be to prepare compassionate human beings who care about the world in a greater sense than how it affects the next election or the job market.
I don't think there's any immediate hope of making education less of a private good. The system suits those who benefit from it just fine, and those who don't benefit don't have enough clout to make their opinions heard, because they don't have enough credentials for the first party to take them seriously. With the decline of the jobs market, there may be a slight shift toward greater vocational training, since there are less jobs for graduating college students, and the amount of debt this group is accumulating is massive. I see currently no reason for democratic equality to become a greater priority because many people voted for the first time ever in the last election (my grandmother included). Many would view this as a sign of affirmation for keeping the curriculum the same. I think this is the perfect example of how democratic education needs to be improved because so many people weren't voting before.
I think Labree covered the major purposes of school to make students into citizens, workers in society but at the same time an competitive individual. But, I felt like he left some key factors out . One thing I think he left out is that school provides students the insight into culture and heritage that illustrates that there are other countries besides USA which broadens the students' horizon. So, that students do know that are people who have been brought up in different upbringings and backgrounds different from theirs. Secondly, schools also help change attitudes and values through the curriculum. For instance, if the child lived in an abusive household, and learnt in elementary school that physical abuse is against the law, his attitude would hopefully change and if he sees someone hitting another and he knows he can do something about it as it is wrong. It would change his outlook. Schools help and change students to see what is right and wrong on an individual level. One last aspect that Labree didn't really cover in depth is the reason that makes school bearable: the relationships one makes between teachers, faculty, and other peers. One learns social skills and how to communicate with others which is key for one to be a healthy and functional individuals. These relationships become a support for the student. The relationships that start in school help the individual later on like in college or in the workforce and outreaching in society.
To be realistic, I do not think in near future that there will be any major shifts toward social efficiency or democratic equality. On an individual level there will be people who will be workers and republicans, but on a holistic perspective, education will be look upon as a private good because it is all about earnings of grades, money, etc. and the benefits that each individual receives that matters. This is our mentality as a society. Maybe as a society we have become very selfish and materialistic and only worrying about ourselves that we cannot look beyond the credentials and a plasma TV's and look at the benefits on humanity level. However, I am a positive person and I think the recession we are in is waking people up to be more involved within society and what would benefit USA as a whole instead of one individual.
Though vague, the purposes of schooling, described by Labaree, are rather encompassing. Article’s, such as described by Sam (humanization), and other value sets, are presumed within democratic equality. Just as well, social efficiency extends its reach into concepts such as communism and fascism. Social mobility on the other hand asserts priorities strongly correlated to the American fundaments of capitalism; putting forth that each individual is accountable for his or her own wellbeing, and status (assuming that all people inherit “social equality” at birth). These examples, albeit out of the box, are my way of illustrating the vast implications of Labaree’s three basic principles. Any change to the education system on a mass scale requires yet greater change to take place in our governmental system first. And just as we discussed in class, such prerequisites create paradoxical systems which require intensive critical thinking to overcome. The struggle, I believe, is our obstinacy to relinquish –for true, to revise- major segments of the constitution. And while we are inflexibly clinging to archaic institutions, in hinting at the notion of redaction and redrafting of the constitution as a whole, people shout heresy, conspiracy, and the like. Nothing will ever change with this mindset. It is one of the utmost patriotic duties of any citizen to question government policy, reassessing and adapting to the modern world, and to rip the seeds of corruption from their lands soil. It is immoral to sit idle and follow orders, disregarding concern for the human experience.
I feel that Labree pretty much covered the main purposes of schools of turning students into, like Sachi said, "citizens, workers in society but at the same time an competitive individual". Sachi brings up excellent points on what was left out by Labree such as social interactions. Schooling gives everyone the chance to interact with others and develop social skills that will benefit the individual throughout life helping form relationships. The ability to have social skills is an important skill to have in college and in the workplace. It is seemingly impossible to be able to acquire and maintain a job if you are not able to socially interact with employers. Thus, socially skills are practically a core fundamental for being able to progress through society.
I agree with Sachi that there will not be any major shifts towards social efficiency or democratic equality. Most americans have a mindset of having to be the very best by getting into the best college through having the best grades. Many americans have to think this way because this is how their peers think; if they don't compete with everyone else in the world, then they will be on the bottom part of the totem pole. Therefore, since everyone already has the mindset of social mobility, I highly doubt that people will start thinking differently.
I think that Sam brings up a very important point- that schools should also attempt to create “compassionate human beings”. Although I realize that there are factors influencing a student outside of the classroom- like culture and family- and that schools cannot be entirely responsible for the type of person a student becomes, they are in a great position to make a difference. Schools can teach students about other cultures and people, different ideas and customs, and in turn mold citizens that are more worldly and understanding. In my opinion, it’s a huge problem that school systems in our country teach with a limited and Eurocentric mindset, inhibiting student’s development as global citizens.
I think that Labaree’s conclusion is scarily accurate. I think it is unfortunate that education has become a means to an end- that end usually being a high paying job or a fancy home. The idea that schooling is merely something that gets you wealth and good fortune is something that I think isn’t changing any time soon. Students are prepared for the competitive market from the moment they enter the school system- working to earn better grades than the next student so that they will be better job candidates when they enter the “real world”. In a competitive market, there is always a need to be the biggest and the best, and educational credentials are one way to achieve that status. Education is marketable- and I can’t imagine a world where that wouldn’t be so.
I agree with Tyler that Labaree has pretty much covered all of the purposes of schooling. Being a better global citizen is something that we would want in the democratic goal - so that we will benefit the rest of humanity as well as peers in our own nation.
I think that sooner or later students and parents alike will have to accept the fact that maybe spending more than twelve years in education does not bring the social status and rewards that they had hoped for. As more and more people have college degrees, there will be more and more competition for higher careers. Personally, I like how the school systems in some countries of Europe are structured. When students leave elementary school, they are split off into three high schools of different level. Students who end up in a trade school are not necessarily left in a bad way. They can also be successful, especially if they become good at whatever trade they learn. If we can accept the idea that a higher education does not mean a higher paying job, then we might have more people going to trade schools. There would still be some competition, but the competition will be more spread out over different levels. I also think that by making the competitions smaller, we would force the students to really hone their skills and show what they know. It's easier to tell who's the best when there are a few hundreds than a few thousand.
I agree that Labree has covered most of the main points of schooling; however, I do think Sam brought up an interesting point about humanization. I think it is important that people today think about more than themselves, more than what will benefit them the most. It is important to have people who are more open-minded to people and environments that are different from their own. I do think that this should be taught in the home life as well, but should be elaborated further in schooling. I do not think that there will be any changes in the near future because it seems that most people are happy with the way things are now. They don’t want to have to worry about the public good, they want to be able to worry about themselves and make sure they get the most benefits they can. I do think that we should change so that we think more about benefitting the public instead of just ourselves; however, I am not very hopeful that this will ever occur. I think overall we are a rather selfish nation when it comes to helping out others and it would probably benefit us to do something like Tom mentioned with the way some European countries do things, but I know that that would not go over too well here.
I think Sam brought up a very true and hard-hitting topic. As one of the approximate seven billion people on Earth, we must realize that the US, although a dominant power in the modern world, is not the only nation to pay attention to and must realize that there are other cultures, languages, and races that blend, like a tapestry, to encompass the world. This consistent notion should be regularly taught through the voice of the teacher. One major point that I think Labaree left out of his article is that school is actually providing students with the skills needed to succeed in the modern day economy. Those skills are accumulated daily by socially interacting with one another. Whether the student is speaking with an adult, child, student, or teacher, the student is constantly bombarded with people of different backgrounds and nationalities further advancing his or her verbal skills.
When it comes down to the topic of education as a private good, I would argue that there isn't a chance to push back the notion of education as a private good. Frankly, I believe people are selfish and that they are only worried about their money, how they'll profit, and how to protect their assets. This belief is further backed up by our current citizen and their views towards money. With the economy the way it is and with money so scarce, I think that it is safe to say that there won't be any democratic equality or acts of social efficiency any time soon.
I also agree that Labaree sufficiently covers all of the purposes of schooling. As far as altering or changing the fact that schooling is used for private good, in my opinion, is not likely to happen. This is a very greedy country that consists of greedy citizens doing what they must to get to the top and initially earn those "credentials"; It's just unfortunately how society in America runs. Like really, think about it. Why are we here at college? Is it for the public good of this country? Or to be able to hopefully get a decent paying job so that we can support ourselves or a family? I find it hard to believe that college students are going into thousands dollars of debt per semester, simply for the "public good". It's sad that we live in such a materialistic world, but it's the truth. I highly doubt that education used for private good will change...or at least not any time soon.
I do feel like Labaree covered the scope of education towards public and private good, but I do feel like he left out, as Sachi said, a cultural good as well as possibly a personal good. Starting with personal good, I feel like education should also be for your own self-interest. Instead of constantly competing with other students, school should provoke curiosity within their students to actually want to learn. I feel like in order to better the citizen; the citizen should want to better themselves first. How can students fight passionately for a better society if they’re more concerned about making a high enough mark on academic test? As far as humanization goes, a part of student’s civil duty should be for them to be culturally competent in order to possibly spark ideas to better our society. Not only is it important to possibly consider teaching a variety of languages at a basic level since the shift from a homocentric America may possibly change, but just for our youth in general to be more aware of the peripheral that is other nations. I feel like there should be hope but not an unrealistic expectation that change will come in the immediate future. I feel like when students stop focusing on social mobility, there will be less focus on advancing privately and more on helping the nation as a whole. When the amount of income stops being the only drive for our future scholars, then maybe the selflessness could help prevail. But like many have said, that is a long time from now.
As I read my classmate's responses, I know Labaree missed several purposes of education. One simple purpose he also left out (and sorry if one of you mentioned it already, and I'm simply not seeing that you did), is socialization. Besides daycare and potential meetings at parks (if parents even take children regularly to local playgrounds anymore), young children do not have many windows of socialization with others like themselves. Interacting with one's peers is a crucial element to development. These interactions often teach children more about how to relate to the world than does simply interacting with parents. Parents are more forgiving of behaviors and words done in a bad mood, for parents oftentimes know why the bad mood exists. The classmate playing with the coveted doll; however, has no idea and could honestly care less. He/she just knows that he/she doesn't like it when a moody child attempts to steal the doll from him/her.
I can imagine a world where education is not such a private good. However, that does not mean that it is either possible or likely to occur in our reality. The system is how it has been for so long, changing it would be rather complicated. People recognize that it is unfair that some children do not receive the same education as everyone else. However, trying to revolutionize a long-standing institution can be a daunting task. Of course, there are people who benefit greatly with things being the way they are presently. They would likely balk at the prospect of change and would fight it.
Labaree proposes three broad purposes of education. His purposes encompass most frames of thought pertaining to education today. But for me one piece of the puzzle that is the purpose of education is missing. Many of my fellow students have pointed out that Labaree fails to see how important cultural understanding is in today’s world. Tom expressed that this could be viewed as a part of the democratic equality purpose, while Sachi and Sam touched on understanding different backgrounds and having compassion or caring for people in other nations. I do believe that cultural understanding is important and that it is true that Labaree does not acknowledge it when discussing the purpose of education. I feel he does this not because the concept is unimportant, but because it is non-existent in our school system today. Labaree’s purposes are theories relating to what is actually going on in our schools and not what he wishes was occurring. Cultural understanding is closely related to another purpose, socialization, proposed by Kateland. This purpose sums up many of the things that I feel Labaree did not touch on. Most importantly, I feel that the major purpose of schools and education in general is to provide a much needed environment where children can receive peer contact in their early formative years. This is also the time that children should be exposed to other cultures and experiences. My opinion parallels many of my fellow classmates regarding public vs. private good. Our political system in every way is revolving around the desires of those in power, which in turn means those with money. The status quo is way too beneficial to these individuals for them to ever support changing the system that maintains it. Our education system today is creating citizens who happily conform to the two party systems, usually aligning their political views with those of their parents. This in effect leads to incumbents winning reelection and therefore the same private interests being served. Sam raises the exact same point I would, which is that if so many of our citizens are not voting and in my opinion are not actually politically knowledgeable in any sense, there must be major flaws in our education system that need to be reassessed.
I think another major purpose of schooling is so much material is covered in school in a semester. As a result, students don’t perceive adequate intellectual depth from that amount of time. The teachers just follow the syllabus to finish on certain topics in certain period of time and move on instead of spending enough time and not making sure all the students comprehend on that subject. Some students study their own and some students just give up because they fail to get interest on learning. In my opinion, the schools really need to figure out to eliminate unnecessary information and focus only on giving enough time to teach to the students. I agree with Sachi where she said there won’t be major change toward efficiency or democratic equality. The whole world is competing with each other educationally, economically etc. So, basically this is the mind set for everyone that better grades get you to better college in order to get better education and better job. I totally agree with Labree where he said social efficiency is also complex coalition where there are working class and lower middle educational consumers who are worried about getting a job than getting ahead. I believe that because one of my friends , she wanted to become a dentist but recently she changed her mind that after finishing undergrad, she will just get a job because she needs to support her family. There are a lot of students like her facing this kind of problems which is affecting them from getting more education. There are a lot of problems to take in consideration in order to improve educational system and it will not be easy fix unless everyone in U.S unites together.
One major purposes of schooling that I feel Labree has left out. The first of which is the actual curriculum in which the school follows. First of all, the curriculum is created by government which is very subjective because of lobbyists and modern day politics. This means that the topics that are actually being taught in school are actually controlled and strategically chosen so that we as students are taught a certain way. This is not right. Moreover, the curriculum so vast that it is nearly impossible for students to understand and attain all the information that is necessary in a one year time which means certain topics are rushed and left out and the emphasis on creativity is left out of the classroom. Making sure the topics are taught are the priority of the teacher, not that the students are learning and engaging actively with the topics at hand.
I completely agree with Labree's conclusion in that merit and grades distinguish students and that students are aiming for getting good graders rather than understanding the actual information which is a problem. Secondly, he claims that we focus on preparing students for work, but remain committed to a thoroughly general education. This is also a very strong point, as general education is important, many students are not actively prepared or trained for their occupational choice as they are too busy fulfilling general education needs, some of which they will never use. Despite their being public education, it is still being privatized as the curriculum is created by lobbyists. In today's age, it is very hard to distinguish the difference between public and private at it has been converging over decades now.
Labaree brought up a lot of good points in his article, yet I feel there was one crucial element that was overlooked. School does all of the things Labree said including preparing workers, preparing citizens and preparing social order. However there was little to no talk about creating people with open minds for learning, learning how to act in society, how to deal with authority and interacting as a caring person. These are all learned aspects of school but they are all good topics to talk about. A lot of students learn how to act in socially in society because of school. Although this is not a "taught skill" its still worth mentioning. This is a skill that cant really be taught at ll. It is learned throught interactions with peers and adults. Students also learn a sense of heirarchy and when leaning how to interact with authority and adults. Caring is yetr another aspect that is not taught but picked up. Learning to care for others and respecting others beliefs, cultures and opinions. All of these topics are in a category all their own but are a very inportant aspect of schooling. Labrees conclusion is somewhat interesting in that its quite old fashioned. In this day and age I doubt preparing a student for a job and political office would be a good example of education. I think that there does need to be that but so much more.
Labaree left out several important purposes of schooling, which could be considered personal development. Personal development includes the fostering of creativity, socialization, and developing a broad cultural understanding. It is important to foster creativity so that we can solve problems in different ways. Socialization is obviously essential for our society to function, social norms must be reinforced. Also it’s important for students to learn about not only our own culture but also others because that is preemptive conflict resolution. It is not only the purposes of schooling, but the way in which students are taught. Students should be challenged to process how what they are learning affects themselves, the country, and the world. Actions have consequences, this is evident in history. However, students rarely are forced to think on a more critical scale where they can see how different choices war, legislation, prejudice, etc. shape our society’s economy, government, international relations, etc.
His conclusion seems too pessimistic. I think there is hope to push back against the predominant notion of education as a private good. The notion of education as a private good isn’t something we naturally have; we are conditioned by the school systems and by our parents. Although most students would probably do just fine if the current grade system was removed. Definitely if you started with young children they would learn despite not having grades.
Honestly, I think the three alternative goals for American education that Larabee covers are broad enough that they touch on a wide array of characteristics that are sought in our society. My classmates brought up missing links like curriculum, socialization cultural understanding, etc. The curriculum is a product of the educational goals valued and deemed important to cultivate in our youth. Democratic equality interjects the need for competency in fulfilling civic duties and creating communities with a homogeneous sense of purpose. I know that primary educators work toward integrating multiculturalism to help students become more culturally aware and appreciative; perhaps some educators do a better job of it than others. Only when one is knowledgeable can one begin to appreciate cultures. To me, socialization, a very important aspect of creating a more egalitarian society, can be found under the umbrella of democratic equality as well. Public schools provide the means for groups of youth to interact that might not otherwise have the opportunities to interact and learn societal expectations. Additionally, social mobility is propelled by self-interest, but in fulfilling self-interest, society most often benefits as a whole. If students are just after the grade and credentials as a means to secure a certain type of job or prestige, then I think they will have a reality check when it comes time to actually perform their chose profession. If learning doesn’t take place along the way through schooling and it’s all just one big social promotion, then workers will not be able to perform their jobs and thus will not be able to keep their jobs. I don’t think that the social mobility factor and seeing education as a private good will lessen any time soon. Meritocracy helps to sort those that are just after a grade in lieu of gaining knowledge and expertise.
Labaree covers the 'gist' of what education is most generally sought out to be by the American public. His three 'alternative' goals including democratic equality, social efficiency and mobility are not all but merely a perspective for what an individual or society as a whole can benefit from education. Practicality in the curriculum of which school teach is important. Without basic fundamental knowledge, working towards specializing in a particular field may potentially be rather difficult.
If education is truly a public good and was solely done for the benefit of society to grow, develop and sustain itself, then wouldn’t school be free of charge like it is for many in other foreign countries? Who’s to tell you, you can’t attend a higher education institution because you don’t have the money? Anyway, I love how some of you guys brought to attention some of the intangible qualities that schooling and education brings to the table. Sam raises a great point about the global impact of the American educational system. I agree with Tyler and his sense of reality and how dramatic of change there would need to be in our government before our educational system is altered for the future. Kateland also raises another key indirect effect that school has which is the development of social skills. You can almost always tell the difference between a child that attended a public or private school as opposed to being home schooled which says a great deal about the impact the schooling environment has on the development of a person’s personality and social interaction. I understand Labaree’s conclusion, but like some others said, it’s a bit pessimistic for something that has a sense of optimism. As much as we can bash and negate our education, there are a lot of things going for us. I think that when it comes down to it, we have to accept that this is the system for now and that we’ll have to do our best to work with it and succeed. Like Kurt mentioned last class, our system does a fantastic job separating ourselves into our own place in society. And in the end it works out...for the most part. Open-minded and critically thinking students like us have come out as a byproduct of our current educational system. Sure we can credit it for long hours spent in the library instead of hours spent in the classroom but still, the freedom for us to go out and seek for information is part of that system. Unless we are speaking of education as a public good, then we can’t generalize the negative and seemingly counterproductive effects of school because it differs on an individual level.
I feel that as far as public schooling has generally occurred thus far, Labaree covers its purposes adequately. However, as Manon noted, he does leave out important purposes of schooling that I believe are relatively ignored by administration and politics, but do occur on a case-by-case basis typically with individual teachers. That is, as far as the purposes this society is concerned about, Labaree covers. However, it is clear that some people, and thus some teachers, do identity important purposes of schooling unaddressed by society.
I would then conclude that there is hope for a change in our education system. In order for education to truly change however, our society would need to see a shift as well. It seems that the driving "value" in society, money, does not much value critical thinking, independent thought about controversial subjects, and the personal aspect involved in true education. If our society can begin to value things other than money or sources of money on a larger scale, it is likely that our education system would follow. So, as always, the way in which humans think about something guides the manner of our society. There is hope, so long as individuals continue to not only think, but act beyond where our society is presently.
I think another major purpose of schooling is humanization. The democratic equality is great but only benefits the US, social efficiency benefits the private sector before any other groups, and social mobility benefits only the individual. Humanization would instead benefit society on a global scale. Rather than looking at education simply as a closed system encapsulating the United States, we have to realize that our educational systems affect the entire globe; therefore, another purpose of schooling should be to prepare compassionate human beings who care about the world in a greater sense than how it affects the next election or the job market.
ReplyDeleteI don't think there's any immediate hope of making education less of a private good. The system suits those who benefit from it just fine, and those who don't benefit don't have enough clout to make their opinions heard, because they don't have enough credentials for the first party to take them seriously. With the decline of the jobs market, there may be a slight shift toward greater vocational training, since there are less jobs for graduating college students, and the amount of debt this group is accumulating is massive. I see currently no reason for democratic equality to become a greater priority because many people voted for the first time ever in the last election (my grandmother included). Many would view this as a sign of affirmation for keeping the curriculum the same. I think this is the perfect example of how democratic education needs to be improved because so many people weren't voting before.
I think Labree covered the major purposes of school to make students into citizens, workers in society but at the same time an competitive individual. But, I felt like he left some key factors out . One thing I think he left out is that school provides students the insight into culture and heritage that illustrates that there are other countries besides USA which broadens the students' horizon. So, that students do know that are people who have been brought up in different upbringings and backgrounds different from theirs. Secondly, schools also help change attitudes and values through the curriculum. For instance, if the child lived in an abusive household, and learnt in elementary school that physical abuse is against the law, his attitude would hopefully change and if he sees someone hitting another and he knows he can do something about it as it is wrong. It would change his outlook. Schools help and change students to see what is right and wrong on an individual level. One last aspect that Labree didn't really cover in depth is the reason that makes school bearable: the relationships one makes between teachers, faculty, and other peers. One learns social skills and how to communicate with others which is key for one to be a healthy and functional individuals. These relationships become a support for the student. The relationships that start in school help the individual later on like in college or in the workforce and outreaching in society.
ReplyDeleteTo be realistic, I do not think in near future that there will be any major shifts toward social efficiency or democratic equality. On an individual level there will be people who will be workers and republicans, but on a holistic perspective, education will be look upon as a private good because it is all about earnings of grades, money, etc. and the benefits that each individual receives that matters. This is our mentality as a society. Maybe as a society we have become very selfish and materialistic and only worrying about ourselves that we cannot look beyond the credentials and a plasma TV's and look at the benefits on humanity level. However, I am a positive person and I think the recession we are in is waking people up to be more involved within society and what would benefit USA as a whole instead of one individual.
Though vague, the purposes of schooling, described by Labaree, are rather encompassing. Article’s, such as described by Sam (humanization), and other value sets, are presumed within democratic equality. Just as well, social efficiency extends its reach into concepts such as communism and fascism. Social mobility on the other hand asserts priorities strongly correlated to the American fundaments of capitalism; putting forth that each individual is accountable for his or her own wellbeing, and status (assuming that all people inherit “social equality” at birth). These examples, albeit out of the box, are my way of illustrating the vast implications of Labaree’s three basic principles.
ReplyDeleteAny change to the education system on a mass scale requires yet greater change to take place in our governmental system first. And just as we discussed in class, such prerequisites create paradoxical systems which require intensive critical thinking to overcome. The struggle, I believe, is our obstinacy to relinquish –for true, to revise- major segments of the constitution. And while we are inflexibly clinging to archaic institutions, in hinting at the notion of redaction and redrafting of the constitution as a whole, people shout heresy, conspiracy, and the like. Nothing will ever change with this mindset. It is one of the utmost patriotic duties of any citizen to question government policy, reassessing and adapting to the modern world, and to rip the seeds of corruption from their lands soil. It is immoral to sit idle and follow orders, disregarding concern for the human experience.
I feel that Labree pretty much covered the main purposes of schools of turning students into, like Sachi said, "citizens, workers in society but at the same time an competitive individual". Sachi brings up excellent points on what was left out by Labree such as social interactions. Schooling gives everyone the chance to interact with others and develop social skills that will benefit the individual throughout life helping form relationships. The ability to have social skills is an important skill to have in college and in the workplace. It is seemingly impossible to be able to acquire and maintain a job if you are not able to socially interact with employers. Thus, socially skills are practically a core fundamental for being able to progress through society.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Sachi that there will not be any major shifts towards social efficiency or democratic equality. Most americans have a mindset of having to be the very best by getting into the best college through having the best grades. Many americans have to think this way because this is how their peers think; if they don't compete with everyone else in the world, then they will be on the bottom part of the totem pole. Therefore, since everyone already has the mindset of social mobility, I highly doubt that people will start thinking differently.
I think that Sam brings up a very important point- that schools should also attempt to create “compassionate human beings”. Although I realize that there are factors influencing a student outside of the classroom- like culture and family- and that schools cannot be entirely responsible for the type of person a student becomes, they are in a great position to make a difference. Schools can teach students about other cultures and people, different ideas and customs, and in turn mold citizens that are more worldly and understanding. In my opinion, it’s a huge problem that school systems in our country teach with a limited and Eurocentric mindset, inhibiting student’s development as global citizens.
ReplyDeleteI think that Labaree’s conclusion is scarily accurate. I think it is unfortunate that education has become a means to an end- that end usually being a high paying job or a fancy home. The idea that schooling is merely something that gets you wealth and good fortune is something that I think isn’t changing any time soon. Students are prepared for the competitive market from the moment they enter the school system- working to earn better grades than the next student so that they will be better job candidates when they enter the “real world”. In a competitive market, there is always a need to be the biggest and the best, and educational credentials are one way to achieve that status. Education is marketable- and I can’t imagine a world where that wouldn’t be so.
I agree with Tyler that Labaree has pretty much covered all of the purposes of schooling. Being a better global citizen is something that we would want in the democratic goal - so that we will benefit the rest of humanity as well as peers in our own nation.
ReplyDeleteI think that sooner or later students and parents alike will have to accept the fact that maybe spending more than twelve years in education does not bring the social status and rewards that they had hoped for. As more and more people have college degrees, there will be more and more competition for higher careers. Personally, I like how the school systems in some countries of Europe are structured. When students leave elementary school, they are split off into three high schools of different level. Students who end up in a trade school are not necessarily left in a bad way. They can also be successful, especially if they become good at whatever trade they learn. If we can accept the idea that a higher education does not mean a higher paying job, then we might have more people going to trade schools. There would still be some competition, but the competition will be more spread out over different levels. I also think that by making the competitions smaller, we would force the students to really hone their skills and show what they know. It's easier to tell who's the best when there are a few hundreds than a few thousand.
I agree that Labree has covered most of the main points of schooling; however, I do think Sam brought up an interesting point about humanization. I think it is important that people today think about more than themselves, more than what will benefit them the most. It is important to have people who are more open-minded to people and environments that are different from their own. I do think that this should be taught in the home life as well, but should be elaborated further in schooling.
ReplyDeleteI do not think that there will be any changes in the near future because it seems that most people are happy with the way things are now. They don’t want to have to worry about the public good, they want to be able to worry about themselves and make sure they get the most benefits they can. I do think that we should change so that we think more about benefitting the public instead of just ourselves; however, I am not very hopeful that this will ever occur. I think overall we are a rather selfish nation when it comes to helping out others and it would probably benefit us to do something like Tom mentioned with the way some European countries do things, but I know that that would not go over too well here.
I think Sam brought up a very true and hard-hitting topic. As one of the approximate seven billion people on Earth, we must realize that the US, although a dominant power in the modern world, is not the only nation to pay attention to and must realize that there are other cultures, languages, and races that blend, like a tapestry, to encompass the world. This consistent notion should be regularly taught through the voice of the teacher. One major point that I think Labaree left out of his article is that school is actually providing students with the skills needed to succeed in the modern day economy. Those skills are accumulated daily by socially interacting with one another. Whether the student is speaking with an adult, child, student, or teacher, the student is constantly bombarded with people of different backgrounds and nationalities further advancing his or her verbal skills.
ReplyDeleteWhen it comes down to the topic of education as a private good, I would argue that there isn't a chance to push back the notion of education as a private good. Frankly, I believe people are selfish and that they are only worried about their money, how they'll profit, and how to protect their assets. This belief is further backed up by our current citizen and their views towards money. With the economy the way it is and with money so scarce, I think that it is safe to say that there won't be any democratic equality or acts of social efficiency any time soon.
I also agree that Labaree sufficiently covers all of the purposes of schooling. As far as altering or changing the fact that schooling is used for private good, in my opinion, is not likely to happen. This is a very greedy country that consists of greedy citizens doing what they must to get to the top and initially earn those "credentials"; It's just unfortunately how society in America runs. Like really, think about it. Why are we here at college? Is it for the public good of this country? Or to be able to hopefully get a decent paying job so that we can support ourselves or a family? I find it hard to believe that college students are going into thousands dollars of debt per semester, simply for the "public good". It's sad that we live in such a materialistic world, but it's the truth. I highly doubt that education used for private good will change...or at least not any time soon.
ReplyDeleteI do feel like Labaree covered the scope of education towards public and private good, but I do feel like he left out, as Sachi said, a cultural good as well as possibly a personal good. Starting with personal good, I feel like education should also be for your own self-interest. Instead of constantly competing with other students, school should provoke curiosity within their students to actually want to learn. I feel like in order to better the citizen; the citizen should want to better themselves first. How can students fight passionately for a better society if they’re more concerned about making a high enough mark on academic test? As far as humanization goes, a part of student’s civil duty should be for them to be culturally competent in order to possibly spark ideas to better our society. Not only is it important to possibly consider teaching a variety of languages at a basic level since the shift from a homocentric America may possibly change, but just for our youth in general to be more aware of the peripheral that is other nations.
ReplyDeleteI feel like there should be hope but not an unrealistic expectation that change will come in the immediate future. I feel like when students stop focusing on social mobility, there will be less focus on advancing privately and more on helping the nation as a whole. When the amount of income stops being the only drive for our future scholars, then maybe the selflessness could help prevail. But like many have said, that is a long time from now.
As I read my classmate's responses, I know Labaree missed several purposes of education. One simple purpose he also left out (and sorry if one of you mentioned it already, and I'm simply not seeing that you did), is socialization. Besides daycare and potential meetings at parks (if parents even take children regularly to local playgrounds anymore), young children do not have many windows of socialization with others like themselves. Interacting with one's peers is a crucial element to development. These interactions often teach children more about how to relate to the world than does simply interacting with parents. Parents are more forgiving of behaviors and words done in a bad mood, for parents oftentimes know why the bad mood exists. The classmate playing with the coveted doll; however, has no idea and could honestly care less. He/she just knows that he/she doesn't like it when a moody child attempts to steal the doll from him/her.
ReplyDeleteI can imagine a world where education is not such a private good. However, that does not mean that it is either possible or likely to occur in our reality. The system is how it has been for so long, changing it would be rather complicated. People recognize that it is unfair that some children do not receive the same education as everyone else. However, trying to revolutionize a long-standing institution can be a daunting task. Of course, there are people who benefit greatly with things being the way they are presently. They would likely balk at the prospect of change and would fight it.
Labaree proposes three broad purposes of education. His purposes encompass most frames of thought pertaining to education today. But for me one piece of the puzzle that is the purpose of education is missing. Many of my fellow students have pointed out that Labaree fails to see how important cultural understanding is in today’s world. Tom expressed that this could be viewed as a part of the democratic equality purpose, while Sachi and Sam touched on understanding different backgrounds and having compassion or caring for people in other nations. I do believe that cultural understanding is important and that it is true that Labaree does not acknowledge it when discussing the purpose of education. I feel he does this not because the concept is unimportant, but because it is non-existent in our school system today. Labaree’s purposes are theories relating to what is actually going on in our schools and not what he wishes was occurring. Cultural understanding is closely related to another purpose, socialization, proposed by Kateland. This purpose sums up many of the things that I feel Labaree did not touch on. Most importantly, I feel that the major purpose of schools and education in general is to provide a much needed environment where children can receive peer contact in their early formative years. This is also the time that children should be exposed to other cultures and experiences.
ReplyDeleteMy opinion parallels many of my fellow classmates regarding public vs. private good. Our political system in every way is revolving around the desires of those in power, which in turn means those with money. The status quo is way too beneficial to these individuals for them to ever support changing the system that maintains it. Our education system today is creating citizens who happily conform to the two party systems, usually aligning their political views with those of their parents. This in effect leads to incumbents winning reelection and therefore the same private interests being served. Sam raises the exact same point I would, which is that if so many of our citizens are not voting and in my opinion are not actually politically knowledgeable in any sense, there must be major flaws in our education system that need to be reassessed.
I think another major purpose of schooling is so much material is covered in school in a semester. As a result, students don’t perceive adequate intellectual depth from that amount of time. The teachers just follow the syllabus to finish on certain topics in certain period of time and move on instead of spending enough time and not making sure all the students comprehend on that subject. Some students study their own and some students just give up because they fail to get interest on learning. In my opinion, the schools really need to figure out to eliminate unnecessary information and focus only on giving enough time to teach to the students.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Sachi where she said there won’t be major change toward efficiency or democratic equality. The whole world is competing with each other educationally, economically etc. So, basically this is the mind set for everyone that better grades get you to better college in order to get better education and better job. I totally agree with Labree where he said social efficiency is also complex coalition where there are working class and lower middle educational consumers who are worried about getting a job than getting ahead. I believe that because one of my friends , she wanted to become a dentist but recently she changed her mind that after finishing undergrad, she will just get a job because she needs to support her family. There are a lot of students like her facing this kind of problems which is affecting them from getting more education. There are a lot of problems to take in consideration in order to improve educational system and it will not be easy fix unless everyone in U.S unites together.
One major purposes of schooling that I feel Labree has left out. The first of which is the actual curriculum in which the school follows. First of all, the curriculum is created by government which is very subjective because of lobbyists and modern day politics. This means that the topics that are actually being taught in school are actually controlled and strategically chosen so that we as students are taught a certain way. This is not right. Moreover, the curriculum so vast that it is nearly impossible for students to understand and attain all the information that is necessary in a one year time which means certain topics are rushed and left out and the emphasis on creativity is left out of the classroom. Making sure the topics are taught are the priority of the teacher, not that the students are learning and engaging actively with the topics at hand.
ReplyDeleteI completely agree with Labree's conclusion in that merit and grades distinguish students and that students are aiming for getting good graders rather than understanding the actual information which is a problem. Secondly, he claims that we focus on preparing students for work, but remain committed to a thoroughly general education. This is also a very strong point, as general education is important, many students are not actively prepared or trained for their occupational choice as they are too busy fulfilling general education needs, some of which they will never use.
Despite their being public education, it is still being privatized as the curriculum is created by lobbyists. In today's age, it is very hard to distinguish the difference between public and private at it has been converging over decades now.
Labaree brought up a lot of good points in his article, yet I feel there was one crucial element that was overlooked. School does all of the things Labree said including preparing workers, preparing citizens and preparing social order. However there was little to no talk about creating people with open minds for learning, learning how to act in society, how to deal with authority and interacting as a caring person. These are all learned aspects of school but they are all good topics to talk about.
ReplyDeleteA lot of students learn how to act in socially in society because of school. Although this is not a "taught skill" its still worth mentioning. This is a skill that cant really be taught at ll. It is learned throught interactions with peers and adults. Students also learn a sense of heirarchy and when leaning how to interact with authority and adults. Caring is yetr another aspect that is not taught but picked up. Learning to care for others and respecting others beliefs, cultures and opinions. All of these topics are in a category all their own but are a very inportant aspect of schooling.
Labrees conclusion is somewhat interesting in that its quite old fashioned. In this day and age I doubt preparing a student for a job and political office would be a good example of education. I think that there does need to be that but so much more.
Labaree left out several important purposes of schooling, which could be considered personal development. Personal development includes the fostering of creativity, socialization, and developing a broad cultural understanding. It is important to foster creativity so that we can solve problems in different ways. Socialization is obviously essential for our society to function, social norms must be reinforced. Also it’s important for students to learn about not only our own culture but also others because that is preemptive conflict resolution. It is not only the purposes of schooling, but the way in which students are taught. Students should be challenged to process how what they are learning affects themselves, the country, and the world. Actions have consequences, this is evident in history. However, students rarely are forced to think on a more critical scale where they can see how different choices war, legislation, prejudice, etc. shape our society’s economy, government, international relations, etc.
ReplyDeleteHis conclusion seems too pessimistic. I think there is hope to push back against the predominant notion of education as a private good. The notion of education as a private good isn’t something we naturally have; we are conditioned by the school systems and by our parents. Although most students would probably do just fine if the current grade system was removed. Definitely if you started with young children they would learn despite not having grades.
Honestly, I think the three alternative goals for American education that Larabee covers are broad enough that they touch on a wide array of characteristics that are sought in our society. My classmates brought up missing links like curriculum, socialization cultural understanding, etc. The curriculum is a product of the educational goals valued and deemed important to cultivate in our youth. Democratic equality interjects the need for competency in fulfilling civic duties and creating communities with a homogeneous sense of purpose. I know that primary educators work toward integrating multiculturalism to help students become more culturally aware and appreciative; perhaps some educators do a better job of it than others. Only when one is knowledgeable can one begin to appreciate cultures. To me, socialization, a very important aspect of creating a more egalitarian society, can be found under the umbrella of democratic equality as well. Public schools provide the means for groups of youth to interact that might not otherwise have the opportunities to interact and learn societal expectations. Additionally, social mobility is propelled by self-interest, but in fulfilling self-interest, society most often benefits as a whole. If students are just after the grade and credentials as a means to secure a certain type of job or prestige, then I think they will have a reality check when it comes time to actually perform their chose profession. If learning doesn’t take place along the way through schooling and it’s all just one big social promotion, then workers will not be able to perform their jobs and thus will not be able to keep their jobs. I don’t think that the social mobility factor and seeing education as a private good will lessen any time soon. Meritocracy helps to sort those that are just after a grade in lieu of gaining knowledge and expertise.
ReplyDeleteLabaree covers the 'gist' of what education is most generally sought out to be by the American public. His three 'alternative' goals including democratic equality, social efficiency and mobility are not all but merely a perspective for what an individual or society as a whole can benefit from education. Practicality in the curriculum of which school teach is important. Without basic fundamental knowledge, working towards specializing in a particular field may potentially be rather difficult.
ReplyDeleteIf education is truly a public good and was solely done for the benefit of society to grow, develop and sustain itself, then wouldn’t school be free of charge like it is for many in other foreign countries? Who’s to tell you, you can’t attend a higher education institution because you don’t have the money?
Anyway, I love how some of you guys brought to attention some of the intangible qualities that schooling and education brings to the table. Sam raises a great point about the global impact of the American educational system. I agree with Tyler and his sense of reality and how dramatic of change there would need to be in our government before our educational system is altered for the future. Kateland also raises another key indirect effect that school has which is the development of social skills. You can almost always tell the difference between a child that attended a public or private school as opposed to being home schooled which says a great deal about the impact the schooling environment has on the development of a person’s personality and social interaction.
I understand Labaree’s conclusion, but like some others said, it’s a bit pessimistic for something that has a sense of optimism. As much as we can bash and negate our education, there are a lot of things going for us. I think that when it comes down to it, we have to accept that this is the system for now and that we’ll have to do our best to work with it and succeed. Like Kurt mentioned last class, our system does a fantastic job separating ourselves into our own place in society. And in the end it works out...for the most part. Open-minded and critically thinking students like us have come out as a byproduct of our current educational system. Sure we can credit it for long hours spent in the library instead of hours spent in the classroom but still, the freedom for us to go out and seek for information is part of that system. Unless we are speaking of education as a public good, then we can’t generalize the negative and seemingly counterproductive effects of school because it differs on an individual level.
I feel that as far as public schooling has generally occurred thus far, Labaree covers its purposes adequately. However, as Manon noted, he does leave out important purposes of schooling that I believe are relatively ignored by administration and politics, but do occur on a case-by-case basis typically with individual teachers. That is, as far as the purposes this society is concerned about, Labaree covers. However, it is clear that some people, and thus some teachers, do identity important purposes of schooling unaddressed by society.
ReplyDeleteI would then conclude that there is hope for a change in our education system. In order for education to truly change however, our society would need to see a shift as well. It seems that the driving "value" in society, money, does not much value critical thinking, independent thought about controversial subjects, and the personal aspect involved in true education. If our society can begin to value things other than money or sources of money on a larger scale, it is likely that our education system would follow. So, as always, the way in which humans think about something guides the manner of our society. There is hope, so long as individuals continue to not only think, but act beyond where our society is presently.